Issue 89152 - [JA] different translations for "Note(s)"
Summary: [JA] different translations for "Note(s)"
Status: CLOSED FIXED
Alias: None
Product: Internationalization
Classification: Code
Component: ui (show other issues)
Version: BEA300m2
Hardware: All All
: P3 Trivial (vote)
Target Milestone: ---
Assignee: yuko
QA Contact: issues@l10n
URL:
Keywords:
Depends on:
Blocks:
 
Reported: 2008-05-08 05:18 UTC by yuko
Modified: 2013-08-07 15:02 UTC (History)
2 users (show)

See Also:
Issue Type: DEFECT
Latest Confirmation in: ---
Developer Difficulty: ---


Attachments
Help (53.18 KB, image/gif)
2008-07-02 05:48 UTC, yuko
no flags Details

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Description yuko 2008-05-08 05:18:39 UTC
There are three different translations for "Note(s)" as follows,so I think that
they should be unified. 

English:
View > Notes
Insert > Note
Delete Note
Delete All Notes by <NAME>
Delete Author's Note

Japanese:
表示 > メモ
挿入 > コメント
コメントの削除
作成者のメモを削除 <NAME>
すべてのノートを削除
Comment 1 yuko 2008-06-27 02:28:49 UTC
Reassigned.
Comment 2 yuko 2008-06-27 02:30:02 UTC
Fixed with Pootle.
Comment 3 tora3 2008-06-27 11:58:57 UTC
tora->yuko: As described in the issue 81315, 

 A word "note" in Writer means comments which might be written down on a small 
 note pad and be sticked on a sheet of document. 

 A Japanese word "ノート", similar pronunciation to an English word 'note,' 
 means a word 'notebook' and does not address to a word 'note' in English. 

Microsoft Office uses a word 'comment' for such use case. I do not know the 
reason why Writer uses a word 'note' for such function instead of 'comment.'

For better interoperability between Word and Writer and easier migration from 
Word to Writer, please keep to use the same Japanese word assigned in Word,
regardless of its original English word in Writer. 

I can suspect that the word 'note' might come from inappropriate translation 
from German - original language of StarOffice - to English - second language - 
at the time of changing the primary language from German to English several 
years ago. 

In sum, i would like to propose a Japanese word "コメント" for an English word 
'note' in Writer. 
Comment 4 yuko 2008-06-30 05:31:35 UTC
We discussed the translation of 'Note(s)' with members in ja-discuss and
ja-translate
and decided to use "ノート". UI and Help were changed and we do not have enough
time to discuss
it again in OOo 3.0. If you disagree, please file a bug about translation of
'Note(s)'.
Comment 5 tora3 2008-06-30 06:36:35 UTC
Yuko, I appreciate you for the efforts and believe you has been working 
hard to make the productive Office suite better and better through 
appropriate translations. 

Proper translations make it strong while poor translations make it worse. 
Please remember that an inappropriate translation led people misunderstood. 

The issue 71775 was one of the cases. Since OpenOffice.org 2.0 Japanese was 
released with an improper translation, users were not able to recognize 
OOo 2.0 became to have the same functionality as Word had. The case taught 
us how appropriate translations were important. In other words, when doing 
translation for software product, to some extent, appropriateness is more 
important than correctness from the point of linguistic accuracy. 

If possible, i would like to propose reverting the changes just for now and 
conducting the research on some software products such as Microsoft Office 
Japanese and Ichitaro to determine what translation could be the best. 

Please reconsider the way to discuss translations with the community. To 
make translations more appropriate, not just only accurate, try more diverse 
people be involved, not just only translators, but also heavy users of other 
software products available in the Japanese market. 

For instance, let us see a function of inserting a comment in both Word and 
OpenOffice.org. Its original texts and their current translations are: 

 Word 2003 English          Insert > Co~mment
 Word 2003 Japanese         挿入 > コメント(~M)

 OpenOffice.org English     Insert > Not~e...
 OpenOffice.org Japanese    挿入 > コメント(~E)...

Please consider why the current translation for 'Note' is 'コメント' but 'ノート.'
Please, please do not make it worse from user's point of view. 
Comment 6 yuko 2008-07-02 05:47:11 UTC
Hi tora-san,

Could you please see the help "Comparing Microsoft Office and OOo Terms"?
(I have attached the screenshot of the help.)

MS Office "Comments" feature is equivalant with "Notes" in OOo.
OOo uses "Notes" recognizing the term's difference between MS Office and OOo.
As you know, it is hard to unify translation with not-literal translation,
so we would like to use "ノート" for "Notes".
If you disagree, please file RFE to OOo UI about "Notes".
Comment 7 yuko 2008-07-02 05:48:22 UTC
Created attachment 54875 [details]
Help
Comment 8 tora3 2008-07-02 06:42:24 UTC
tora->yuko: I can agree with your point. It would be better to translate an 
original term literally rather than do it non-literally. 

Another point here is that a Japanese term "ノート" does not means an English 
term "Notes" in this context. There would be a possibility that typical Japanese 
users mistakenly recognize "ノート" as "ノートブック" for an English term 
"a notebook." That would make Japanese users greatly confused. 

Within Latin originated languages, "notes" normally refers to "comments" instead 
of "a notebook." While in Japanese English, "ノート" normally addresses to "a 
notebook."

I know this kind of discussion is meaningless. So if you want, you, I, or someone 
else can file another issue to propose to revise a current term "Notes" to 
"Comments." 
Comment 9 tora3 2008-07-02 06:51:32 UTC
Just one idea.

How about use of another translation such as 
 メモ
 注釈
 覚書
things like that?

Those might be better translations than "ノート" that could be easily 
misunderstood by typical Japanese. 
Comment 10 yuko 2008-07-18 05:25:08 UTC
English message was updated to fix 89213, but the translation for "Delete ~All
Notes by $1"
has not been included in CWS:localisation29 build yet.
Need to verify in the next build.
Comment 11 yuko 2008-08-21 09:17:41 UTC
I verified that the translation for "Delete ~All Notes by $1" appeared in OOO300_m3.